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[-] GregorGizeh@lemmy.zip 0 points 5 months ago

Staatsräson 🫠

[-] gibmiser@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago
[-] Johanno@feddit.de 0 points 5 months ago

I as a german asked an expert on that topic. Chatgpt. According to chatGPT there is no genocide if you don't kill them with the intention to wipe them from the planet. So if for example you drop accidentally poison into their water because you mixed the Botox and sugar bottle in the water station then even if they all die it is not a genocide.

And since chatgpt is infallable this is the only truth.

[-] amzd@kbin.social 0 points 5 months ago

Except that basically all Israeli politicians have made statements saying they have genocidal intentions.

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[-] Raykin@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

Upvoted but I wish you would have run your post through ChatGPT as well my friend. That was hard to read.

[-] Karyoplasma@discuss.tchncs.de 0 points 5 months ago

Comma rule in German is so fucked that normal humans just give up and never use any.

[-] verdigris@lemmy.ml 0 points 5 months ago

None of those sentences needed commas, they're just not constructed very clearly.

[-] Karyoplasma@discuss.tchncs.de 0 points 5 months ago

I've counted 6 missing commas.

[-] verdigris@lemmy.ml 0 points 5 months ago
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[-] brbposting@sh.itjust.works 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

I, as a German, asked an expert on that topic: ChatGPT. According to ChatGPT, there is no genocide if you don't kill them with the intention to wipe them from the planet. So, if for example you accidentally drop poison into their water because you mixed the botox and sugar bottle at the water station, then even if they all die it is not a genocide.

And since ChatGPT is infallible, this is the only truth.

Six commas, colon, capitalization, word order, word choice, “infallible”. Infallible like my editing 🤓 & dunt u disagreeme

PS: I speak zero languages (rounded), good job all who learn English and attempt to use it

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[-] carotte@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Good thing then that Israeli politicians haven’t been on record saying that Gaza needs to be "wiped from the face of the Earth"!

[-] Kusimulkku@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

Yeah, genocide often requires intent. So I guess this could be more of a massacre than a genocide.

But there's quite a few different definitions, some are more lax.

[-] melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Except for all the politicians, from shutzstaffel commanders to the (Hitler apologist) PM's PR guy saying exactly this, using words like cexterminate' 'wipe from the earth' 'every last one' and many individual storm troopers posting on their social media (in videos while doing war crimes), or even their 'civilians' frequently saying it

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[-] A_Very_Big_Fan@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

To meet the legal definition of genocide, you also have to have the intent to destroy a particular group of people. So, legally speaking, your example isn't genocide according to any source.

I don't know the motives behind the Israel/Palestine conflict or how it started, but if it doesn't involve an intent to destroy Palestinians specifically, I guess I could see how GPT's take is valid. Like, the war in Ukraine is egregious too, but that by itself doesn't make it a genocide.

[-] DragonTypeWyvern@literature.cafe 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Deliberate displacement of particular ethnic or religious groups is also recognized as genocide, in particular because it's often a pretext. ChatGPT is wrong, and needs to read the UN definition.

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[-] saltesc@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

Every Jew in modern day Germany...

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[-] lugal@sopuli.xyz 0 points 5 months ago

We know genocide, we had one

And no, the Herero and Nama genocide wasn't a genocide

[-] Orbituary@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

Those were practice rounds?

[-] einlander@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

Sparkling Genocide

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[-] psvrh@lemmy.ca 0 points 5 months ago

If it weren't tragic, it would be funny.

[-] ooli@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

Being on the wrong side of history on the same topic 75 year apart

[-] JusticeForPorygon@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago
[-] Siegfried@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

Well, he is right, its mass murdering, but not genocide.

[-] DragonTypeWyvern@literature.cafe 0 points 5 months ago

Wait until we find his 2012 Twitter handle calling everyone but Titans unnecessary

[-] desktop_user@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 5 months ago

If I randomly kill all humans it would be genocide. I absolutely hate the common usage of the word, but killing all humans definitely would be genocide.

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[-] jkrtn@lemmy.ml 0 points 5 months ago

Israel: [Murdering journalists and foreign aid workers] see? It's not only Palestinians, it's random.

[-] PatFussy@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

Maybe because what is happening is not genocide?

[-] RedditWanderer@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Youre gonna have to be a bit more specific in your defense. They have been killing all Palestinians, have been saying that all Palestinians are Hamas (including kids), and have said multiple times they want to wipe them off the face of the earth.

How is that not genocide?

Benjamin Netanyahu has in recent days called on politicians to choose “their words carefully” so as not to give ammunition ahead of the hearing in The Hague, Vaturi on Wednesday reaffirmed his calls to “wipe Gaza off the face of the earth,” and added: “Gaza must be burned.” “I stand behind my words... It is better to burn down buildings rather than have [Israeli] soldiers harmed. There are no innocents there,” he said in a radio interview before calling for the “elimination” of the estimated 100,000 Palestinians left in northern Gaza. “I have no mercy for those who are still there. We need to eliminate them,” added Vaturi, who belongs to Likud, the right-wing party led by Netanyahu.

[-] PatFussy@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

If there was an intent to destroy Gaza and all it's inhabitants Israel would have done so already. I probably need to see more justification than some emotional outburst a few days after getting terror attacked and israeli citizens kidnapped.

Your arguments are weak. Yes there is a sad situation where a lot of Palestinians are dying but it's not a genocide.

[-] blitzkrieg@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

What do you call ethnically cleansing and starving an entire population? Is that not genocide?

[-] PatFussy@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

I think Lemmy likes perpetuating a particular propaganda that keeps reiterating the same talking points until they are engraved in your brain. Genocide is an extremely specific judgement that requires both evidence of specific intent and specific action. You can make claims to one but not to both. The intent doesn't match the action.

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[-] HawlSera@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

Germany, are you going to be responsible for EVERY FUCKING World War you humans fight in!?! Liiiike feck.

[-] melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

Is all champaigne from france?

If Germany's not on the wrong(er) side, its just a sparkling global conflict.

[-] Randelung@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

😂 but also 😭

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[-] S_204@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

I'm inclined to believe they have the expertise and experience to make this claim.

[-] melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

I'm not. They've lied about this shit before.

[-] Randelung@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

In a world where they don't have their own agenda (e.g. military income), I'd agree.

In THIS world, where the AfD has a considerable voice and the government blocks itself on gender inclusive language and rather does nothing, I don't. Let's not call it genocide, then we don't have to act. Let's not be too hasty about Putin so we don't have to send any help. Let's think about weed legalization for half a decade to be sure.

I think they're being obstructive on purpose.

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[-] volvoxvsmarla@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

(Preface: I am team genocide. I also live in Germany. Germany's politics are a disgrace, but I digress.)

What annoys me about this is that this discussion gets so much media attention and focus, while it doesn't matter in this very moment. I understand that there are implications if it will be defined as a genocide. But right now people are being killed every day en masse and they frankly give a crap about whether they died in a mass murder or terrorist attack or a genocide.

It reminds me of the early days of the Ukraine war when everyone was so obsessed with comparing Putin to Hitler (Putler is still a popular term) and the discussion was high on whether Putins actions amount to fascism or not, with a lot of internet laymen but also experts on that subject chiming in. When I asked a half Russian, half Ukrainian what their opinion was, their reply was something like "who the fuck cares? Call it a chicken pea pie, nobody cares, people are being killed, I don't give a crap. Somewhen in the future people will be looking back and asking the same question, but it doesn't matter right now." And it stuck with me.

If I understand correctly, the ICJ will rule again on the case in a couple of years (?), which obviously isn't relevant right now. It seems like the ruling would have an aftermath in retrospect but even if they ruled it were a genocide today, nothing much would change directly - but please correct me if I am wrong here.

But what definitely doesn't matter is what we think. What matters is what is happening. And it doesn't need a name to be evil and detrimental.

[-] AreaSIX@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

Germany has supplied 30% of Israel s weapons, and has continued to do so during this ongoing genocide. If Germany or the US were to acknowledge the ongoing genocide, they'd have to stop supplying those arms immediately, hence stopping the annihilation of Gaza. So it's of immense importance to keep repeating what most of the world already acknowledges: this is a genocide, and those arming the perpetrators are complicit in their crimes. History will not judge Germany kindly, but I guess that's not exactly a new thing for a veteran perpetrator of genocide.

[-] volvoxvsmarla@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

Ok, this sounds valid. But what would oblige them to stop them from delivering weapons if the ICJ rules it is a genocide? Is there any legal obligation, can they denounce the ruling?

If you mean acknowledge in a sense of civilian/political acknowledgement, then my issue with it is that it shouldn't be necessary to be this anal about some definition. It's splitting hairs on cut off heads. Supporting mass murder is wrong in the context of genocide as well as outside of it. It shouldn't be necessary to convince the governments that it is a genocide to convince them to stop supplying weapons.

[-] Linkerbaan@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

Israel already received an ICJ ruling to immediately stop their blocking of aid which they ignored.

It's safe to say the ICJ is nothing but a feel good tool that everyone including the West ignores when inconvenient.

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[-] melpomenesclevage@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

”i am team genocide"

-volvoxvsmarla

I dunno, can we trust them? Agree tho; people are dying and it needs to stop no matter what we call it, even if there were no larger implications; its fucking pointless and needs to stop.

[-] volvoxvsmarla@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

I hope I won't be remembered for this quote. I'll choose my phrasing better in the future.

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[-] CameronDev@programming.dev 0 points 5 months ago

Its only a genocide if it comes from the third reich. Anything else is just sparkling ethnic cleansing.

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[-] barsoap@lemm.ee 0 points 5 months ago

Genocide, as in the legal definition, requires intent. As far as I see it Germany is not even trying to deny anything Israel did or does, all the government is basically doing is arguing "Your honour, our client can't have intent because they're demonstrably criminally insane, we know because we caused that insanity". Not in that many words, but to that effect.

[-] pyr0ball@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago* (last edited 5 months ago)

And a sane person/nation would willingly engage in genocide? Insanity doesn't negate intent, only ones ability to distinguish reality or prevent themselves from carrying out actions they know to be immoral. Inb4 India, China, the USA, and Russia of course but you take my point?

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[-] Linkerbaan@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

Germany moment

[-] Aceticon@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

Should say "Genocide Denial Expert" in that plaque.

[-] Harbinger01173430@lemmy.world 0 points 5 months ago

We should cancel Israel on the internet already

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this post was submitted on 07 Apr 2024
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