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Palestine-Israel Crisis Megathread II
(lemmy.ml)
This is the second megathread for discussion regarding the crisis.
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Please remember that all community and instance rules apply to this thread hence keep is civil.
There hasn't been elections for 16 or 17 iirc so how can Palestinians "get rid of" Hamas?
Hamas was supported & funded by Netanyahus likud party specifically because it drove a wedge between those in Gaza and in the West Bank. Classic divide and conquer technique.
As for what Israel can do? They can get rid of the genocidal crook that's running their government and his two murderous far right henchmen and grasp that he had concocted this situation for several reasons:
To divert attention away from his corruption and fraud indictments
To quell the protests that have been going on for months against him because of the corruption and legislation he has passed to curtail the supreme courts ability to hold the executive to account.
To level Gaza, ethnically cleanse it & genocide the Palestinian people so he can get to the natural gas and oil reserves there.
Yes, there's a lot Israel can do and it needs to be quick about it.
It sounds like you just put everything you don't like about Israel in that answer, but without actually giving an answer how this actually could be handled. "Just don't to bad stuff, do good stuff" How would that have been an appropriate response to the terrorist attack?
You're talking as though the attacks happened in a vacuum, without intelligence from several sources pre-warning of it and without a certain level of collusion from the Israeli executive to allow it to happen and bring capitalised by then for it's maximum effect.
When you can genuinely approach the subject not from such a disingenuous perspective then my response may well be perceived by you as a bit more than "If you don't want to be taken for a cunt then don't act like one "
For me it sounds like you are you saying, they deserve the terrorist attack and are not allowed to react to it.
That would be the exact reactionary response I would expect from someone with no grasp of the history, its complexity or even a miniscule amount of knowledge of the atrocities that have been carried out against civilians by both sides
Then you're just ignoring geopolitics and talking about who said what.
We can't change the past. What should Israel do now?
So you didn't bother to read my comment then?
If you're too lazy to do that, why the fuck should I put any effort beyond this in replying?
I did. Replacing the government with one less bad would be good, but what should such a theoretical good government do in response to the Hamas attack? For example, I think more fewer air strikes and more ground combat would be better for minimizing civilian casualties, though more Israeli soldiers would die as a result.
Restore Palestine to the 1917 borders. Grant all Palestinians equal rights within those borders. All zionists who were involved in perpetrating war crimes either directly, or indirectly via policy, to face trial at the Hague
That would desolve the state of Israel wouldn't it? That isn't really tennable for an Israeli government to do.
I really don't care whats tenable for a state born out of terrorism that has been carrying out ethnic cleansing and genocide against the indigenous people for the last 70 plus years.
They have no fucking legitimacy and as much right to continue to exist as the NSDAP government after WW2.
Do you think there are any solutions short of that? Because saying Israel should just dissolve is supremely unhelpful.
They could allow Palestinians full rights and statehood in Israel, with protections from the racist inhabitants.
To clarify, are you saying give the West Bank and Gaza strip statehood as a Nation of Palisade separate from Israel, or give the people there citizenship as Israelis?
Israel has no intentions of backing down, so in my feeble mind they should be given Israeli citizenship with extra protections.
Stop using the phrase "terrorist attack" to mean "unspeakable evil that can never ever be justified by anyone for anything and can never be questioned and must be responded to with all possible violence means necessary".
Terrorism is an act of political resistance, by definition. It is any violence used to inspire fear and bring about political change.
The political change being sought is the end to slow genocide, the end to apartheid, the end to violent displacement, the end to violent neglect, the end to subjugation. When analyzing the situation, the decision was made by the resistance fighters that this action would lead to political change, and so far that possibility is still there.
Israel's response should have been ages ago. It has no legitimacy anymore. It exists purely through violent domination. There is no way for Israel to respond correctly except to begin the political process of dissolving itself and ceding power to the Palestinians. They won't do this, so literally anything else is just going to be a continuation of the last 80 years of violent oppression. There's no way for Israel to act correctly because it hasn't been acting correctly for decades and responding to this attack isn't going to change that.
What might change it is their military being bested by the resistance, their missile defense shield being shown to not protect anyone, fear on the part of settlers causing them to abandon settlements, and internal rebellion demanding justice and ending the illegal occupation.