i think that the first sign of enshitification is its leaders and it seems like it's already here.
i'm wondering what browser to switch to next.
Zen browser has been an interesting experience. Librewolf & Mullvad have been great 🤠
librewolf is my most likely bet; i want to stay away from anything chromium based.
ladybird might become a thing someday. And if all else fails we can still use curl or emacs.
I’ve also been trying out zen. While I really enjoy the sleek Ui and some addons it’s kind of slower than „vanilla Firefox“ which it depends on if I’m not wrong. I’ve tried on multiple machines though mainly on my work laptop which is quite beefy. I’m still using zen though so take what you want from that.
Lynx
lemmyverse
Dammit you beat me to it
Librewolf is firefox based but still good for now. But long term we need either another engine or a major fork of firefox not just a cleaned up copy.
This process has been underway since the project switched their focus from the Mozilla Suite to Firefox. Early Firefox was lightweight with limited features and the idea that you would add your own as extensions for the features you wanted. Then it started gaining traction and the Mozilla developers started forcing features in that should’ve been extensions. It’s been downhill ever since!
Can confirm, this is accurate.
A few months ago people would have still downvoted your comment, but the message has made it to everyone now. Mozilla and with that Firefox is an endangered species that needs to be steered back into safety.
Until people are donating enough money to make maintaining an open source browser doable, this will continue to happen.
The thing is that we need a better donation system, for people to trust it.
An auditable system, and goal oriented.
I'm tired of donating to something and seeing that instead of the good project I wanted my money went to some crazy side project or to some over the top salaries for high corporate.
We need some kind of trustable platform that audits where donation money goes, and enforces binding of the donated money for the purpose it was donated for.
I got really burned with the whole wikiMedia thing. And since them I'm very cautious to who I donate to.
Wuh oh, I'm OOTL here, what's happening to Firefox?
Nothing. People have been memeing about it’s death for 10 years.
I had another reply that gave a decent reason to support the meme :)
They've been making announcements indicating that they're going to start focusing on chatbot/AI/LLM bullshit instead of what they should be doing, which is maintaining their web browser.
🤮
Welp
There's also the news of them forcing opt-out only on tracking today or yesterday
Then there was the news that they fired one of their open source executives because he had the audacity to get cancer
Then the news that they (Mozilla) acquired an ad company because "we're built different and we can fix her and totally not get corrupted by ads in the process"
Also the AI shit as commented
Oh and then the news where they almost sucked Putins dick and pulled FF from being accessible in Russia for a day or 2
And a bunch of other stuff that I'm probably forgetting about. And that's just within the last year
Well I guess I need to start looking for another non-chromium-based browser soon...
Firefox users were too cocky and wouldn't shut up about how amazing it is. The universe took them down a peg.
Do you hear that Linux users?
Do you hear that Linux users?
There's only one Firefox, there's fucktonnes of Linux Distros. I am even willing to move to fucking Arch if push comes to shove.
Librewolf, Mullvad, Tor, Snowwassel... There's more than one Firefox. Surely if some fucked up AI integration was included, one of them would just disable it.
None of them have the manpower or money to maintain a browser engine.
For reference, Opera stopped years ago and even Microsoft gave up.
the so called end-of-world "enshittification": anonymized telemetry
good way to see who's paranoid ngl
It's not just that, it's the AI bullshit they're adding too that will absolutely have forced data scraping eventually since we're "using their product." They'll have some bullshit excuse like "we don't take your browsing data, just the data of any interaction with our AI product for training purposes."
You know because…?
This blind hate of AI is also a great sorta red flag. Currently afaik it's only for auto image captions and some not even released (?) feature. Not all AI is the hostile copyright ignoring AI like gpt and shit
I've seen predictions of Firefox's downfall for decades. Still waiting for it to happen.
It's really easy to see the headlines saying things like "Firefox is tracking it's users and violating their privacy!!!" And panic. But digging into the latest "scandal" (the PPA), it seems like Firefox is behaving pretty reasonably.
One of the main criticisms is that it's opt-out instead of opt-in. Which... I kind of agree with Mozilla on. 99% of users aren't going to know or care about this, and the 1% that do are the kind of people who probably would have extensions to disable it or just use some obscure ultra-private browser instead.
I don't fault NOYB for bringing it up either. It's good to have organizations like that keeping an eye out for everyone.
But I also get worried that sometimes communies attack their closest allies for being imperfect harder than enemies actively working against their interests.
If they were violating people's privacy, it would be completely unacceptable to make it opt-out.
But they aren't. They are doing things that some people believe they'll want to violate people's privacy in the future to do in a different way.
I didn't know what it was, so I looked it up. Their description is here:
https://blog.mozilla.org/netpolicy/2024/08/22/ppa-update/
It sounds interesting.. It also sounds like it will fail, because Mozilla seems to think that trackers are primarily interested in collecting ad stats, and that targeted advertising is less critical, but I think in reality it's the other way around, and advertisers won't accept such a limited solution.
I'm just following the warning signs, in the last year:
There's the news of the opt-out only on tracking as you brought up. Then they fired one of their open source executives because he had the audacity to get cancer. Then they acquired an ad company because "we're built different and we can fix her and totally not get corrupted by ads in the process". Then the AI shit oh and ofc the news where they almost sucked Putin's dick and pulled FF from being accessible in Russia for a day or 2
And a bunch of other stuff that I'm probably forgetting about. And that's just within the last year.
Google and Chrome were great to! Until they weren't. FF probably won't ever actually die, not for a while at least. But the User and Privacy first aspects certainly will. They'll probably succumb to enshittification and become like any other corporate browser like Chrome or Edge for years to come.
Ah I just searched for Firefox news and the PPA thing was the only one that came up.
As for firing the executive, I can't find anything about him being specifically relayed to being open-source anything. Steve Teixeira was their Chief Product Office briefly- he only was hired in 2022 and left the company a few months ago, and prior to that he worked for Facebook, Microsoft, and Twitter. So I don't think this can really be framed as some attack on open-source or privacy. If the allegations are true that they discriminated against him for having cancer that's shitty of course, but Mozilla has of course claimed that they did not and it's going to court. They didn't fire him either- they asked him to take a demotion to Senior VP of Technology Strategy and he chose to leave instead.
Yes Mozilla bought an ad company. They're called Anonym and their stated goal is to provide an advertising service that can exist profitably without violating privacy. I hate ads- I block as many as I can and I use a pi-hole. I avoid ad-supported services as much as possible. I'm also privileged enough that I can afford to pay for a subscription to a lot of stuff or just buy physical media to rip and store on my own server. But there was a time when I was a broke college student stuck using campus Internet and playing by their rules, so the safest option I could afford was just to watch ads. Ads can be an ethical business model that helps improve the lives of low-income households. For people with legal or ethical concerns about piracy, or additional restrictions on their Internet, or who just lack the technical skill.
It's certainly fair to keep an eye on Anonym and Mozilla in this regard, but I haven't seen anything objectionable there yet.
Similar for the Mozilla AI. It seems it's still in it's infancy and I'm not a fan of companies jumping on the air bandwagon in general, but at the very least Mozilla has identified the problems with other AI's and is looking to create a better alternative. If they get caught stealing training data, releasing tools to allow high schoolers to make deep fake revenge porn, tell people to start putting glue in their pizza cheese, or some other crap like that then they should absolutely be criticized for it. But none of that has happened yet that I'm aware of.
I also can't find exactly what you're referring to with Russia. The closest thing is that it looks like there were some extensions that were made to work around Russian state censorship. The Russian government passed a law in March banning such workarounds. In response, Mozilla took down 5 extensions, reviewed them, and then decided to reinstate them in June. Not quite ideal, but still seems like reasonable action to me.
It's fair and a good thing to criticize Mozilla and Firefox. But it seems like you're trying to spin every single move they make as a sign the sky is falling.
And I also know that there are both states and corporations paying people to go on the Internet and push propaganda. Firrfox has a lot of enemies. You cant just blindly believe every article saying they are succumbing to enshittification.
The sanest take yet. If this were reddit and gold meant anything, you'd deserve it
I like how whoever made this didn't bother to put IE on the first door.
This is a 100% handmade meme by me lol
I actually did consider putting IE, but then I realized IE never went through enshittification it was just always shit lmao so it didn't fit
IE used to be great. But that was when the animals still spoke.
This is actually perfect in that enshittification is exactly like death: it comes for everyone or in the context of technology, everything.
There is no popular product or service that doesn't eventually get the enshittification treatment to squeeze more blood from the stone.
Not quite, I don't think. Enshittification is driven by profit motive, which means if there's no money at all involved, then there's no motive.
I guess you chose your words carefully though because the terms 'product' and 'service' pretty much imply that money is involved somewhere there.
I'm really holding out for Ladybird.
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