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What is the Israel thing going on?
(lemmy.world)
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this post was submitted on 10 Oct 2023
191 points (85.8% liked)
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The current engagement is largely guerilla tactics against military installations.
This is not armed struggle. The Palestinians have a right to armed struggle.
The current engagement bombed a music festival.
That is absolutely part of armed struggle. Look at ukraine, and how its usage of global opinion saved it from a 2 week slaughter fest by giving it the backing of US intelligence. Ukraine perfectly demonstrated how, if you are the underdog losing the war, being able to shift global public opinion of your situation can literally save your life.
Instead, they alienated every nation who had a civilian at that event, gave israel an excuse to declare war and openly genocide their people instead of hide it in inches, made it racially charged by immediately releasing a statement blaming zionist jews and calling for jewish extinction, and gave their political opponents across the globe free and easy ammunition to shut up any pro palestine rhetoric or talking points.
Hamas really fucked up. They gave anti palestine sentiment a free scapegoat target. They are lucky spain is taking the charge to try and distance palestine from hamas on the global stage, because its going to be even harder to shake israel of its massive global backing that it relies on in order to hold on to power.
I sympathize with palestine. Israels government is run by monsters. But this action may be the spark israel needed to burn palestine to the ground, and its very very very hard to un-bomb civilians.
A music festival on the edge of the world's largest open-air prison is not a neutral event.
Courting public opinion is not armed struggle.
We agree that Palestinians have a right to armed struggle, right?
How do you recommend they go about that?
Hahahahahahaha, what??? Proximity to a prison doesnt make it a military target. They would have fucked up just as bad if they attacked the prison. Civilians are still civilians even when you disagree with how they spend their time. Unless you think the bombing of hiroshima was justified?
You were already given an answer. Repeating the question means I will repeat my answer. If you dont understand how the global stage is now a part of armed warfare, you are behind every armed force on the planet.
Ok, you answered that guerilla tactics would be best.
Any guerrilla struggle involves harm (even if accidental) to civilian populations.
If we agree that Palestinians have a right to armed struggle, and agree that they should use guerrilla tactics, why are you not supporting them?
Because that was not a guerrilla tactical strike? Nor was it accidental? It was a war crime.
They intentionally targeted civilian gatherings. Thats not armed struggle, thats cold blood killing.
Are you claiming the US was justified in its atomic bombing of hiroshima? By your given criteria, it also falls under armed struggle. Do you not believe it was a war crime?
I do consider it a war crime, I used it as an example because that's not common in Western spaces.
I'll be happy to concede to you that the attack on the music festival was reprehensible, if you can concede that the Palestinian attacks on military installations were appropriate and called for.
Are you, like.... stupid?
My stance from the beginning was always that palestinian attacks on israeli military installations is justified. Theyre being invaded. The problem is hamas commited a war crime that gave israel the justification to begin unquestioned and uncovered genocide.
Could you get your head out of your ass and stop trying to justify war crimes in your slobbering hunger to see the shadow of a drop of isreali blood? Youre continuing hamas's work of making israel look good, and palestine doesnt need more enemies.
You called a music festival a non neutral event, for fucks sake. Are you trying to demonize palestine? Is that your goal?
A little, yeah.
I didn't see your support for Hamas' actions in this thread, sorry if I missed it.
The zionist entity is constantly commiting war crimes. I don't think it needs an excuse.
I don't think the zionists constantly bombing children makes them look good.
I don't agree that it was a neutral event, but I'm happy to concede it as wrong for the sake of the argument here.
Oh gross are you just an antisemite?
Israel as a nation is the problem, not jews bud. Get a life
People like you are the reason israel is going to win, and I weep for your palestinian victims
No, I am not. I have not said anything antisemitic, and will not.
I agree that settler-colonialism, as represented by Zionism, is the problem. Judaism is not synonymous with the zionist project.
I'm happy to see that we've wound down your arguments to where you're grasping at straws and making up things to argue against.
We'll see.
Zionist has been an antisemetic buzz word for almost a century, bud, but it does explain why you were so happy to see the music festival victims.
And why you seem so keen on hamas, despite their recent announcements of goals which include a racial jewish clensing.
Sucks that you are using palestine as an excuse for your garbage. Normal folk are upset at civilian death.
I agree with most of what you've said, but just throwing in my 2 cents that I've never heard Zionist as an antisemitic buzz word, I've only ever understood it to as a way to differentiate Jews who support the Israeli and it's settler colonialism project, and those who don't. Maybe antisemitic use it, but I don't think it's a common dog whistle (like globalist is, for example).
You comment that you are a fucked up person if you find it ok to kill civilians.